Constructive possession atf. absent intent (mens rea) , its not constructive possession.

Constructive possession atf Dec 7, 2024 · What is constructive possession of an unregistered NFA item? Constructive possession means having the ability to control an item, even if it’s not in your direct physical possession. While I completely agree the chances of getting into trouble for having a 10 inch barrel and a ar are very slim that is a risk I myself would not want to take nor woudl I recommend to others to take. I would go off that info directly from the atf panel and not speculate personally. Constructive possession. ). May 23, 2023 · Did not watch any of the vids, but if you have possession of a pistol and a stock/brace for that pistol, and the ATF/courts consider the brace to be a stock, then that is constructive possession regardless of where you store the stock. Or sell it as an SBR with a form 4 transfer…but good luck finding someone who wants to do that Feb 5, 2025 · Constructive possession means you possess the parts necessary to assemble an NFA item, even if they are not currently assembled. So I will call the FFL that I will have do the Pin/Weld and ask their advice. or your local ATF office. As sort of a warning that having that pile of parts might be considered illegal. The court held that the district court did not err by declining to accept defendant's proposed amendment to the jury instruction defining "possession;" the district court's jury instructions were accurate and defendant was not entitled to a particularly worded instruction as Constructive possession would be a situation in which there’s no other logical reason for intact items to be in your possession but not together, unless you were trying to conceal something. Under constructive possession, the weapon must only be accessible to the prohibited individual. Under 18 U. This can create serious legal issues, even if the access was unintentional. Carson, 2017-Ohio-7243, ¶ 17 (8th Dist. Constructive possession extends beyond physical possession to include control or access to a firearm. And people are right to be concerned. If it's not registered with the ATF, you cant just have the brace sitting next to the thing because you can turn it back into an SBR in 3seconds. The ATF’s view on stabilizing braces has evolved significantly. Feb 6, 2007 · However, your posts rooted in a stupid hatred of the ATF combined with your extreme ignorance of the real definition of constructive possession in particular, federal laws in general, and how ATF and the US Attorneys do business, is just making you look like a fool. Wikipedia does a decent job explaining it: Constructive possession is a legal fiction to describe a situation in which an individual has actual control over chattels or real property without actually having physical control of the same assets. " Does your wife have the combination to your safe where you store your suppressor? Congratulation, according to this ATF rule, you're now both felons. Constructive possession is a situation where someone has access to or control over an NFA item without being the registered owner or a listed responsible person in the trust. Aug 30, 2017 · Plus I'm also curious as I've never seen discussion of the constructive possession implications for this particular group of parts, mostly because most people don't find themselves in this situation, but with the morass of the NFA and ATF rules, every step is a potential unintentional federal felony (and if I'm going to go to prison, I at least Nov 20, 2019 · As best as I could tell (at sort of an advanced undergrad level of research) constructive possession is something that originates in ATF opinion letters. . App. What is “constructive possession” in relation to AR-15 pistols? Constructive possession means you have the intent and ability to control an item, even if it’s not physically in your Feb 5, 2025 · Constructive Possession: Even possessing parts that could be assembled into an illegal configuration (e. Feb 1, 2024 · Constructive possession of a firearm differs from actual possession. The ATF’s Stance on Stabilizing Braces. Aug 24, 2013 · SBR Lower (SBRL)-- a fully assembled AR platform lower receiver whose designation was a rifle as its first configuration and registered with the ATF as an NFA item Unless otherwise stated, when 'possession' is used without designation, it should default to the 'constructive possession' definition. possessing something that could be turned into something illegal. possession" as used in this section means both actual and constructive possession. If you own an AR-15 pistol and a stock that can readily be attached to it, the ATF may argue that you have constructive possession of an SBR, even if the stock is not actually attached. We seek to expand… Feb 5, 2025 · Understanding Constructive Possession: Be aware of the concept of constructive possession. Feb 20, 2025 · Brandon Wade Kurns, a convicted felon, began working at Modern Pawn & Consignment in Helena, Montana, in June 2021, where he sold firearms and ammunition. Episode 20 The Ventura Hells Angels are bombed, but the ATF see us as suspects, not victims. But what does “constructive possession” or “constructive intent” mean, and how do they relate to the ATF Final Rule on stabilizing braces? Armed Attorneys Emily Taylor and Richard Hayes discuss the complex legal concept, and whether it has relevance with pistol stabilizing braces and the new ATF Final Rule. What you're talking about is strict liability. For example, if you have an AR pistol with a 7. LEXIS 11886, *6. Feb 5, 2025 · Constructive possession means having the intent and ability to control an item, even if it’s not in your immediate physical possession. Jan 25, 2023 · Only Responsible Person(s) listed on the approved registration may have physical or constructive possession of the NFA item. But if some of your home defense weapon have silencers on them, and someone had Dec 5, 2016 · The ATF has a different opinion about your statement. In July 2021, after an investigation linked stolen gunpowder to the shop, ATF agents searched Modern Pawn and found evidence that Kurns had possessed several firearms. What is constructive possession? Constructive possession refers to having the ability to exercise control over an item, even if you don’t physically possess it. You are being pedantic. Possession, however, is not limited to the non-registered person being caught red-handed with your suppressor. Jul 18, 2019 · I have recently blogged about the issue of constructive possession of NFA firearms in my article NFA and Constructive Possession: Myth or Reality?. Aug 30, 2017 · Plus I'm also curious as I've never seen discussion of the constructive possession implications for this particular group of parts, mostly because most people don't find themselves in this situation, but with the morass of the NFA and ATF rules, every step is a potential unintentional federal felony (and if I'm going to go to prison, I at least Jan 26, 2023 · Notice the "constructive possession" phrase? According to lawyers, that means if another person knows about it and has "access" to it, then they legally have "constructive possession. 6. For example, possessing a short barrel and a stock that could be used on an AR-15 pistol could be considered constructive possession of an SBR, even if the stock and barrel are not attached to the firearm. The best answer is convert it back to pistol form, send a letter to the ATF to take it off the registry- confirm that the atf actually did so…then sell it as a pistol. , was arrested by an undercover officer when he sought to sell his Heckler and Koch SP89 pistol. For example, owning an AR-15 pistol and a stock could be considered constructive possession of an SBR. For example, if you have the parts to assemble an SBR or AOW and the intent to do so, you could be charged with constructive possession, even if the firearm is Mar 7, 2011 · With ATF Ruling 2011-4, the entire "constructive Intent" or "constructive possession" thing gets turned on it's head. Cry me a river. It boils down to the theory that a prosecutor could and would argue that even though the parts weren't configured in an illegal fashion when they caught you, they probably would have been if they had caught you at a different time. You mean constructive possession. Bailey , where mere existence of a firearm in a borrowed car could not uphold constructive possession, constructive possession cannot be established on the basis of ability to control alone. 18 U. Dec 7, 2024 · Avoid constructive possession: “Constructive possession” refers to having the parts necessary to assemble an illegal firearm, even if the firearm itself is not assembled. 8. Frequently Asked Questions (FAQs) 1. A community of hobbyists interested in NFA items, history, and news. Another example, straight from one of the ATF’s FAQ ATF did try that years ago, but under EPA decision guidance they have to actually be able to point to a "Constructive Intent" piece of congress, senate, and president signed legislation which I am unable to find any evidence of having been passed. (6) " Assault weapon Jan 9, 2012 · The ATF uses constructive possession as a tool to get those who are hard to catch in the act. (Linked below) With the opinion letter, you can build a stripped lower into a pistol, and then convert it to a legal rifle, and back again at will as long as you don't put a stock on it when it has a less than 16" barrel on it. Has the ATF ever pursued a constructive possession charge? Not that I am aware of. Probably just store the barrel at a friends place until I am ready take the parts the FFL for the gunsmithing. There is no such thing as "constructive intent. In criminal law, establishing constructive possession is often done to further prosecutions for 14 votes, 26 comments. Wow!!! I have a complete 1919 bolt that came with a parts kit sitting in front of me next to a 1919 semi gun. Remember that there is no intent element to violate the NFA. 5" barrel and no brace but you also have an AR with a 16" barrel and a brace, they can allege Constructive Possession because you could conceivably swap lowers to make an SBR. Consequently, constructive possession is much more difficult to prove If what you are saying is true, 99% of the nation is in constructive possession of an SBR an SBS or a destructive device. ATF Form 5400. The ATF has confirmed that you are legally allowed to leave the 6-position rifle buffer tube on the gun, however, you need to be careful of constructive possession (see below for full details). Sep 26, 2018 · No it's not constructive possession, because you have a lawful use for all the parts. C. It is about the prosecutor "constructing" a persons possession of an unregistered firearm, ie demonstration you posses it when you don't actually posses it. Document everything: Keep records of all purchases, modifications, and any correspondence with the ATF. Constructive possession is a thing, but merely filling out a Form 1 does not require you to possess anything. Technically you shouldn't possess both a short barreled upper and a rifle lower unless you have a pistol lower to attach the upper to, as it would be considered constructive possession. You must obtain ATF approval, pay a transfer tax, and register the silencer before possessing it. Make sure that a drilling fixture is not in your possession or under your control at the same time that you own any M16 military (“drill and pin”) autosears, or AR-15 rifles, or AR-15 lower receivers. Intent: Courts may consider your intent when determining whether a firearm is an SBR or an Sep 2, 2009 · AK Discussion Forums. May 23, 2023 · The reality is atf decides on a case by case basis and they gave examples in the brace rule training (mentioned earlier) that says what would be constructive possession and what would not. We seek to expand general understanding… Dec 7, 2024 · Constructive possession is a legal doctrine that can have significant implications. v. 191K subscribers in the NFA community. §§ 842(d), (i). If constructive possession isn't a crime then it's virtually impossible to catch someone with an illegal weapon unless they take it to a public range. 141 by proving constructive possession of that firearm. What does “fire control group” mean? Dec 7, 2024 · Yes, but silencers are regulated under the NFA. Is it considered constructive possession for that person? Scenario 2: May 12, 2016 · Constructive possession. personally I keep questionable parts under a different roof. 5861(d), 5871). A 3D printer, a file of a gun, and filament wouldn’t be considered constructive possession of a firearm since you haven’t printed anything yet. This article aims to provide a comprehensive understanding of constructive possession, its implications, and its relationship to the National Firearms Act (NFA) and the recent rule change on stabilizing braces. The ATF's final rule on stabilizing braces has raised concerns and questions among gun owners regarding constructive possession. 28 is used to determine the eligibility of the EPs to possess explosives materials. I myself took an ATF webinar some months back (I work at an FFL) and someone asked about constructive possession and the guy doing the webinar said verbatim, "just don't keep the brace and the gun in the same dresser drawer" What wonderful clarity they've offered Nov 23, 2024 · “Constructive Possession” means having the parts required to assemble an NFA item, even if the item is not fully assembled. Dec 5, 2024 · It is not intended to be shouldered like a rifle stock, although this distinction has been a source of ongoing legal debate and reinterpretation by the ATF. There's no such thing as "constructive possession" in statute. It is an ATF contrivance. g. Turnbough, 1997 U. " You are talking about "Constructive Possession. For example, someone with keys to a safe deposit box may have constructive possession to the contents of that box. Oct 15, 2013 · There is a lot of confusion regarding the concept of constructive possession as it relates to components which can be assembled to make a regulated firearm (in this case an SBR). " This has nothing to do with construction of an unregistered NFA gun. , a short barrel and a vertical foregrip) can be construed as “constructive possession” of an unregistered NFA item, leading to legal trouble. Dec 2, 2024 · Some AR-15 pistols may be exempt from NFA regulations if they meet specific criteria outlined by the ATF. May 3, 2010 · So at home in the safe is your full-length AR15 & a short upper. However, these exemptions are rare and often subject to change. tion you provide on this form will allow ATF to determine whether you, an employee possessor in the explosives business or operations, are prohibited from shipping, transporting, receiving, or possessing explosive materials. If you possess parts that, when assembled, would create an illegal firearm (like an SBR without proper registration), you could be charged with constructive possession. There's no such thing as constructive intent. Mar 23, 2023 · An NFA firearm need not be assembled to be regulated as such. They come after Ventura members with a legal tool. As they used to say, ATF has let the horse out of the barn, it's a little late to lock the gate now. Jan 20, 2023 · Constructive possession means that while you don't physically possess the prohibited item (ie. • For importers and manufacturers with SBRs equipped with a “stabilizing brace” that are in their possession, complete and submit through the eForms system a Notice of Firearms May 31, 2023 · The ATF has confirmed that you are legally allowed to leave the 6-position rifle buffer tube on the gun, however, you need to be careful of constructive possession (see below for full details). 28 Revised February 2003 Constructive possession exists when an employee lacks direct It is clear that "possession" under SEA includes "actual" as well as "constructive" possession. May 31, 2023 · If you have an AR-15 pistol, it is as simple as pulling the brace off the buffer tube. Dec 2, 2024 · Constructive possession refers to the legal concept where you are deemed to possess an item even if it’s not physically in your possession. It essentially means having the ability to control an item, even if it’s not physically in your possession. General AK Discussions Constructive possession is FUDDLORE. Is that constructive possession? The parts can legally be assembled, just not at that immediate time. As seen in U. Intent is essentially impossible to prove in court unless you literally admit to it. A keychain that looks oddly like a jig for a 3rd hole for sale under the “gun parts” section of the website. M2 Carbine hammers. What if the SBR is under a trust, and another trustee is at home and has access to the safe. If you leave the house, and other family members know the code to the safe, they are technically considered to be in constructive possession of your NFA item. For example, owning an AR-15 pistol and a rifle stock could be considered constructive possession of an SBR. ” Constructive possession can be the same legally as actually holding something, say a silencer that is not registered to you, in your hands. (A potential solution to the constructive possession problem may be to keep the compatible pistol and Micro-Roni at different addresses, to make sure that it's clear they can't Unlawful possession of an unregistered SBR is punishable by up to 10 years’ imprisonment or $10,000 in fines, or both. absent intent (mens rea) , its not constructive possession. Also under the “gun parts” section is a GI joe edition BCG that looks Feb 5, 2025 · Constructive Possession: Owning parts that could be assembled into an NFA item, even if they are not currently assembled. It's only constructive possession of NFA if you have no other possible use for the parts except an illegal NFA assembly. Accordingly, “the state need only show that the defendant had possession or constructive possession ‘at some point’ during Feb 5, 2025 · “Constructive possession” means having the parts necessary to assemble an illegal firearm, even if it’s not fully assembled. Jul 8, 2009 · Constructive Possession exists when a person knowingly has the power and intention at a given time to exercise dominion and control over an object, either directly or through others. This can be a crime. , an employee who May 16, 2024 · 5. Better safe then sorry. Mar 27, 2017 · ATF has ruled that manufacturers may make and sell products such as the Mossberg Shockwave firearm (by ATF decree, it is not a shotgun) and that anyone may own one, state law allowing. In the future, if you need to add an additional Employee Possessor (EP) to your Federal Explosives License or Permit (FEL/P), the EP being added must complete a new ATF Form 5400. For Jan 20, 2023 · Constructive possession means that while you don't physically possess the prohibited item (ie. A Responsible Person (RP) Constructive possession. (5) " Constructive possession" means having the power and the intention at any given time to exercise dominion or actual control over the firearm either directly or through another person. ATF still considers that 'constructive possession of a Short Barreled Rifle', and without a tax stamp, that's a federal felony good for up to 10 years if convicted. Jun 21, 2014 · constructive possession is an ATF expression in which all the parts are readily available within a single confined area to bypass taxation, and is usually an add on charge for other charges. Constructive Possession: Possessing the parts that could be assembled into an NFA item, even if the item is not fully assembled. For example, possessing both a pistol and a readily available rifle stock can be construed as constructive possession of an illegal short-barreled rifle over a firearm for the purposes of R. Under Federal explosives laws it is unlawful for certain prohibited persons to possess explosives. 2941. (26 U. Now the ATF may frown upon them being stored beside each other and consider it something like “constructive intent” but technically it’s not illegal. EACH EMPLOYEE POSSESSOR MUST COMPLETE AND SIGN A SEPARATE QUESTIONNAIRE - ATF FORM 5400. Reply reply Constructive Possession is easy to accuse and difficult to prove. You're correct, but you're wrong. This is a vital consideration for AR-15 owners. What is the effective range of a Draco pistol? The effective range of a Draco pistol is generally considered to be 100 to 200 meters, although accuracy may vary depending on factors such as shooter skill and ammunition quality. 13. " Constructive possession is demonstrated when the defendant is not in physical possession of the firearm but she has the conscious dominion and ability to control the firearm. OK, than it's virtually impossible. Website sells almost nothing else other than stickers and patches. Jun 23, 2023 · Under the theory of “constructive possession”, possession of a banned pistol brace and a pistol the brace will fit could be enough for arrest and conviction of possession of a Mar 25, 2023 · Generally speaking, possession of an NFA firearm or regulated item by someone other than the registered owner could be viewed as an illegal transfer. Oct 10, 2023 · The ATF has a decades-long history of pressing regulatory enforcement actions based on its own constructive possession theories in other NFA contexts, where the mere ease of creation of a subject May 3, 2016 · Florida Man Arrested for Constructive Possession of an SBR I have recently blogged about the issue of constructive possession of NFA firearms in my article NFA and Constructive Possession: Myth or Reality?. No one has ever been charged with constructive intent, much less convicted of it. You could get around this if the lower you bought does not have a stock attached, you could simply build it as a pistol with the short upper you want. My opinions and certainly not in any way legal advice. The best thing to do in my experience is to just purchase a brace and use it as your stock until stamp is approved, that way you can use the gun and it can’t be confused as an SBR if you Jan 10, 2025 · Constructive Possession in a Shared Residence. , was arrest… Aug 6, 2020 · The Eighth Circuit affirmed defendant's conviction for unlawful possession of a firearm as a previously convicted felon. ), citing State v. Same goes with a short barreled upper and a stocked lower. STOP SHARING THIS MYTH. ATF says yesthe Supreme Court said NO. The ATF’s interpretation of this doctrine can be complex. Kurns was indicted and pleaded guilty to being a felon in possession of a With the imminent stabilizing brace deadline from the ATF Final Rule looming and compliance methods being questioned, the newest 2A buzzwords, constructive p Jun 23, 2023 · If, instead of a stock, you have in your possession one of the banned pistol braces under the new rule by the ATF, you may be violating the law with the constructive possession of a short-barreled The ATF has created something of a legal fiction called “constructive possession”, i. Jan 25, 2023 · You can literally have a letter from the ATF saying that as long as you can take immediate possession of your NFA item, you can let someone use it (my uncle has one of these, which is how I shoot his suppressed SBR), and a different ATF agent can slap the cuffs on both of us regardless of what his letter says and simply say that whoever issued Dec 24, 2010 · After surfing through the AR 15 parts on M&A Parts Inc. (The spare upper may be used on the pistol and the lower could, at minimum, be used on the rifle). The law on the book is for unregistered possession of X not constructive possession of X. Constructive intent is not a thing. This can apply to firearm parts. When do gun kits and parts turn into legal firearms? How does the recent pistol brace ATF ruling impact this? What is constructive intent when dealing with Constructive Possession then. "It would actually be MORE of a constructive possession if you gave the stock to a friend because it implies Feb 10, 2014 · The above info is correct from my understanding but there is one more issue to consider. Mar 3, 2022 · Possession is an ambiguous term and is not limited to how “possession” may be used in every day use; it includes so called “constructive possession. If a person removes their brace but keeps it, and if the pistol it was removed from is the only firearm in possession that the brace could fit on, it could still be considered a short-barreled rifle under constructive possession and the owner could be The legal term for this is called "constructive possession", generally if you can assemble the parts without modification of the firearm you are considered in possession of a fully assembled firearm even if it is found disassembled. Jan 24, 2010 · ATF said possession of the kit was constructive possession of a SBR is merely possessing a pistol barrel and rifle barrel as you described "constructive possession " of a SBR. § 845(a)(1) these prohibitions do not apply to any “aspects of Jun 5, 2023 · Because of the issue of “constructive possession,” problems can arise for some gun owners. That's why Dec 20, 2024 · Constructive Possession and Compliance Risks. On August 27, 2009, Jesus Amador, Jr. S. e. What are the consequences if I choose not to register my firearm with a “stabilizing brace,” which is a short-barreled rifle (SBR), and keep it? | Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives Jan 26, 2023 · Reports that the ATF had changed the rules for possession of NFA items broke yesterday on Twitter and other social media platforms. Reactions: Snapper314 , ken226 , Terrible_Long_Gunner and 2 others HOOFER Constructive possession is the legal possession of an object that is not in the person’s direct physical control. Nov 20, 2019 · As best as I could tell (at sort of an advanced undergrad level of research) constructive possession is something that originates in ATF opinion letters. If you have multiple AR-15 lowers / rifles (not SBR) and are storing in same place as your multiple short uppers there could be concern about constructive possession to try and convert your additional lowers into illegal SBR's. ” State v. This means that even if you haven’t assembled the AR-15, possessing all the parts necessary to readily assemble it into an illegal configuration can be considered a violation of the law. ¹ When NFA-regulated items are in possession of someone other than the registered owner it could constitute an unlawful transfer subject to the severe penalties of the NFA For example, someone with keys to a safe deposit box may have constructive possession to the contents of that box. Or having SBR parts that aren't currently in SBR form. ATF, which uses the shorthand term "employee-possessor" for "persons authorized to possess explosive materials," says that "actual" possession exists when a person is in immediate possession or control of explosive materials - e. The ATF says nothing about locking your NFA firearms away except in the case of them being left at a residence or storage that is not yours. Giguere, 2023-Ohio-4649, ¶ 20 (8th Dist. While the law hasn’t gone quite that far, it’s still pretty much full you-know-what since owning, for instance, an AR-15 rifle while at the same time owning a pistol-length upper but no dedicated pistol lower is constructive possession. This concept is particularly relevant in shared residences, where a felon may not physically hold a firearm but could still be deemed to have control over it. Like other “constructive” meanings, constructive possession legally functions as actual possession in a variety of ways. The issue of constructive possession can arise in the context of NFA Assets if, for example, a husband, in his legal capacity as an individual, submits an ATF Form 4, pays the tax, lawfully takes possession of an NFA Asset, and then stores that NFA Asset in the home which he and his wife share. For example, possessing an AR-15 lower receiver, a short barrel, and a stock could be interpreted as constructive possession of an SBR, even if they are not assembled. The idea is that simply possessing parts you intend to use to create the suppressor makes you guilty of owning a suppressor or suppressor parts. The controversy was stoked by a new entry in the FAQ section of Constructive possession exists AFTER a license or permit has been issued in order to ADD you as an employee when an employee lacks direct physical control over explosive materials, but possessor, then the form number must be accompanied by a signed letter from the exercises dominion and control over the explosive materials, either directly or Actual possession exists when a person is ATF E-Form 5400. It's a myth. Nov 14, 2018 · While there are not any constructive possession cases involving NFA firearms this does not mean that the BATFE could not bring a charge of constructive possession against a spouse or other person who could exercise dominion and control over an NFA firearm. From the ATF website: "Possession of an unregistered M-2 conversion kit, which consists of the following seven parts, constitutes possession of an unregistered NFA firearm; regardless of whether or not assembled; Selector Selector spring Selector lever assembly Hammer Disconnector If you have all the parts of an SBR un-assembled, it can be legally construed as constructive possession, putting you in violation of the NFA. 189K subscribers in the NFA community. Whether a person may be in constructive possession of an NFA firearm depends on the facts of a particular case. 28. com I clicked on M-16 disconector, at the bottom it said " Possession of any 1 machine gun part constitutes Constructive Possession of a Machinegun". Aug 18, 2020 · Saw this on Reddit earlier posted in r/gundeals. US v. Option 3 - Forfeit Firearm to ATF Oct 26, 2017 · Constructive possession of SBRs? Give me a break. This is a complex Feb 6, 2007 · However, your posts rooted in a stupid hatred of the ATF combined with your extreme ignorance of the real definition of constructive possession in particular, federal laws in general, and how ATF and the US Attorneys do business, is just making you look like a fool. SBR), you have in your control all of the required elements to possess it. Dec 10, 2024 · Possession of a drilling fixture BY ITSELF is not considered “constructive possession”, even today. Mar 25, 2023 · Constructive possession exists when a person knowingly has the potential for access or control of NFA firearms outside the supervision of the registered owner of those items. To demonstrate actual possession, you must prove that the individual has physical control over the firearm. The following assumptions should be made as Feb 14, 2023 · possession, complete and submit through the eForms system an Application to Make and Register a Firearm, ATF Form 1 (E-Form 1) before May 31, 2023. wmqjpj wtdzi mrvgu sybfbq zfbh ybewnvb wuklq vqro uyz rvjerh jagold oamyuh urmq cxd hjgyx